Episode 11. Flying Into Enemy Fire with Peter Gibbs

This week on Legacy; Survival Stories,  lifelong underwater escape specialist and friend of the show, Peter Gibbs is back. This time he takes us into the Falklands war. Serving as a commando helicopter crewman, Gibbs and squadron 8825 come under attack while moving 3000lbs of high explosive to the front lines.

Hosted by Dan Latremouille

Come visit us at https://legacysurvivalstories.buzzsprout.com

Contact us on... 

legacysurvivalstories@gmail.com

twitter.com/legacy_survival

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCjKUHEwaagX5zwAH4WbjW1w

Transcript

0:02

The time is spring, 1982. The place is the Falkland Islands. The situation is as follows. The Falklands War is underway. Commando helicopter crewman Peter Gibbs and the eight to five squadron are tasked to fly ammunition to the front lines during a routine hover over the drop site. While carrying 3000 pounds of high explosive crewman, Gibbs notices the ground troops suddenly scatter. Then the explosions begin. This is legacy survival stories, going down, you're going down. Legacy; Survival Stories. Hi, everybody. Welcome back to Legacy Survival Stories. I'm your host, Dan Latterman. I think it's safe to say that my life personally has been fairly interesting, and some would even say blessed. I've had a lot of exotic and wonderful adventures. I've also had some harrowing and terrible adventures. But I think it's also safe to say that my interesting life doesn't hold a candle to today's guest. I would like to welcome back to the show friend of the show, the legendary, the heroic Peter Gibbs. Ladies and gentlemen, thank you. Come back here. Thank you. That was a great intro. You're very welcome. And I meant every word. Thank you. You are as as myself, my colleagues, and those of us that mutually know you. You're a hard guy to trade stories with. You've you've led certainly a life that is well, let's say I look forward to reading your memoir. In fact, I'll help you edit them. Could be a pro bono thing I'd be happy to do. Thank you, Dan. So Peter has been on the show before, and we welcomed him back to the show because of his incredibly interesting life and his warehouse full of incredible stories. So with that said, Peter, what have you got for us today? Well, I thought I'd tell you about. I started as a search and rescue diver. And then, of course, eventually I had to go away and do something else. Right. And that's the rules of the Navy. And so I ended up or on my advice from my seniors that it would probably be a good idea if you were to go and become a commando helicopter crewman, a commando helicopter crewman. Now, when I hear the word commando. That sounds pretty tough and hard core. Is it is it is it aligned with what I'm thinking about it? It is in the in the sense that you would go and join a commando helicopter, if you want to call it flight training. And what that entails is that you would also learn a huge amount about the Royal Marines who are part of the Royal Navy. And and then you would spend a lot of time of your life flying Royal Marines around, taking them to places where, you know, they have to do their work. So as a commando, so you're still part of the Navy, but you're flying around Marine units. So basically, you're the Navy. You're you're almost transport, but also tactical is that. Yes, you're you're the actual commando squadrons were really basically used for the movement of troops. All right. But obviously, with the Royal Marines being part of the Navy, we would work a lot with the Royal Marines, paratroopers, all these Special Forces type. And that's what we did. OK, so for the folks back home, in case you missed previous episodes with Peter Gibbs, just a quick synopsis of some of Peter Gibbs, his colorful background, which includes him enlisting in the Royal Navy at a fairly young age, 17, 18 years old. You. And he was an able bodied sorry, an able seaman, I believe what they call us. Right. And still less able. And he then segued into a helicopter mechanic, and that then led to him working as a search and rescue diver for a number of years in Her Majesty's Royal Navy. And then that brings us back to where we are now for today's story, where he has transitioned from that on to a tactical commando unit. Now, do they call it a commando unit? They call them commando squadrons. Really? So that's the actual name. That's an actual name, because it sounds like I mean, I don't mean any disrespect, but when you say commando, it's sort of, you know, sounds like, you know, when Mike and I are talking about a a video game or a movie where they have a commando guy, but that was the actual title. Yeah. And the reason I'm talking about this is this particular story is really one from the Falklands. OK, so are we talking about the Falklands War? Yes. OK, so can you give us an approximate year? You know, I can see it would be roundabout. I think it's 82. OK, 1982, give or take, give or take. All right. Well, listen, we're not we're not this isn't this isn't legal documentation. We're just trying to set the tone for those listening at home approximately when this would be. All right. So this is Peter Gibbs now, and he's over in the Falklands. Yeah. So you you got to understand, I'm on a search and rescue unit and the Falklands War breaks out. But I'm already a commando trained crewman. All right. So I'd already done the course. And then what happens is on there as a search and rescue diver. And then when the actual hostilities break out, the British military say why we need some more commando squadrons. So they just made one up. And basically, any of the helicopters that were being used were seconded to the airbase that I was at. So this is the sort of military reaction slash government reaction to a war that that breaks out somewhat unexpectedly. Yeah. And now all of a sudden you're repurposing existing units. Yeah. OK. And so people that were already commando trained helicopter aircrew or I, I just got seconded to a squadron, eight to five squadron, which was made up of qualified helicopter instructor pilots and then pilots that weren't qualified. They hadn't finished their flying hours or anything like that. So they were capable of looking at the instruments and the, you know, pressures and the gauges and stuff like that. But they weren't actually some of them weren't qualified with their actual wings. OK. Right. So be able to sort of operate the machine, but not certified and qualified to take it into a mission. Yeah. OK. All right. And so they they banded this squadron together and then we all set sail and went to the Falklands. OK, so you're boarding a aircraft carrier or something, right? Oh, no, no. The the Brits, they we just took a lot of merchant ships and put flight decks on the back and said, no, do away and away we go. And so even though I mean, they took the ships from the merchant navy, and what we basically did is the aircraft were on the front of the ship and then all the living accommodation just welded onto the back. And away we went and we arrived in the Falklands. And, of course, you know, the the story I'm going to tell is is really one of, you know, sometimes survival is just knowing what to do at the right moment. And you'll probably survive if you're lucky. Okay. But this actual incident, we get up early one morning like we always do, and we know what we're going to do. We go to the operations tent. They tell us that we want you to move all this ammunition up to close to the front so that the the guns can , you know, keep harassing. The Argentineans are up in the hills. So this is. Yeah, so you're moving we're talking artillery type man. Oh, yes, you're talking. You know, they call them like guns, but they're they weigh about 6000 pounds each and they fire, you know, huge, great shells of people, you know. Yeah. So like like guns being a relative term. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. And so in this particular day, I am flying with a a very experienced pilot and a McIlhaney pilot, if you want to call. OK, OK, Mickey. Learning, making, learning. OK. And and the guy that I'm flying with, the captain of the aircraft, he is well-to-do. And he he, you know, is a gentleman by trade. You know, he's a what we would call a private school boy. You know, he's had a good upbringing, but he's in the Royal Navy. He is a lieutenant commander and he's a very good pilot. So you're painting a picture here, and I'm starting to imagine a sort of a very straightlaced by the very. Yeah. And, you know, but he also knew that there are things that I might like to know, the petty officer games, because all the petty officer, then he might be able to help me. All right. Things like petty officer games. I got this brand new machine gun. I've just got it from stores. Do you know how to put it together and. Well, yes, I do know how to put it together. All right. And you have. To know how to put it together, to make it work, you know, and on on the machine guns make great paperweights otherwise. Yeah. And on the first night of, you know, being in the Falklands, we're all what we call in the middle of the night. We stood to you know, we've been warned now that there are Argentinean soldiers in in the close vicinity of us. And of course, we're all in trenches and our sailors and guns. You know, it's a little bit can be a little bit dangerous. All right. So we're all down in the trenches and everything. And then up comes this certain lieutenant commander saying Petty Officer Gibbs announcing officer. Can you put this machine gun together for me? I think I do. So enjoy win one Brit makes fun of another Brit for the high brow. I love it. OK, so he's asked you to put together. So I'm there. And I say, sir, sir, get down. Lie down. All right. Don't you know? So when you say slit trenches, we're talking three or four feet. Yeah. Yeah, we're we're just in, you know, they're basic, you know, to protect you from, you know, what a sick thing, you know. Yeah, it's really. Yeah. OK. And he's standing there, you know, and what he's doing is he's, you know, Skylink name or, you know, he's like a loon illuminating himself against the moon. The biggest stone in the making. A very easy target. Yeah. Get down like. And so he's there. And I say to him, look, he gets in this little slit trench. I said, you know, now is not the time. Have you got any ammunition with you? And he goes, no. I said, well, it's no good anyway. I said, why can't we wait till it's daylight and I'll put it all together for you. And he says, good idea. But he said, I'll stay in your trench. So we stay there. We don't get attacked by the Argentineans. But the following day we go flying and and we're shifting huge amounts of ammunition amped up to the front. And you take three thousand pounds of high explosive underneath the aircraft. And when you bring it into the Hova, when you say sorry underneath. So you're you're you're slinging Slaney underneath. OK. And so when when you bring it into where the guns are, what the you know, the the soldiers are doing is they'll position it so that they can get it off the pallets and to the gun really quickly. OK, because they want to fire as much as they can. Well, we've been doing this for about an hour. And coming in landing or, you know, coming into the hover, moving the load closer to the gun. And this particular time, we come in and as we come into the hover. All right. I'm looking at the soldiers. They're all looking up and they're about to grab it all and maneuver it to where they want it, as they've done on all the previous loads. Yeah. And then all of a sudden I see them all run away. And I say to them, my pilot put it down, put it down, put the load down now. And he goes, what? What's going on? You know, like this? And I said, something's happened. They're all running away. And so we land quickly. Now, we got 3000 pounds of high explosive land or put it on the ground, just dropping a load of it. Yeah, but we're not trying not to drop it because it's high explosive. All right. So, so so placing it on the grayslake on the ground before, but not but not putting the helicopter on the ground. OK. And so we released a load and I said, get out of here now. Move, do go somewhere. Right. And as we're pulling away like this, all of a sudden a load and mortars drop around us. And now a mortar, for those of you don't know, does a lot of damage that you can have Airbus mortars, you know, explode in the air when they get close to the ground or they go in the ground and they explode then. Right. When these explode in the ground, which was lucky. And it frightens him. It frightens me and it frightens me. If you learn he pilot. And so we move away. And and as we move away, he says, I've got to land on and I've got a gun, have a cigaret like this. So after I watch this like a scared me so badly, it rattled me. I need a cigaret. Yeah. And like the rest of us, if you smoke, you just do it in the aircraft. But he wants to land on, get out and go and have a smoke. That's fine. Right. But now we land on and we can already hear the combat air controllers. And what they're doing is they're talking to Harrier jump jets. And we can hear this on the radio and they're going to come in and they've got a fire control officer who's sitting in the mountain some. And he's worked out where these mortars are coming from and these Harriers are going to go in and light it up . Yes. Yeah. And but the funny thing is that the he gets out in the aircraft and he's standing there smoking or all, and all of a sudden, out of nowhere come these two Harriers, you know, really fast. And they're moving towards where we were. And then they struck off and they drop all the bombs on the side of the hill or is a mountain and they just erupted. And again, like I'm saying that it was absolutely amazing because that frightened him to death even more, because then he realized that, oh, we are in an actual combat zone. This is what does happen, you know. And he when he got out of the aircraft, he said to me, I want you to sit in my seat. Petty Officer Gibbs, and don't let him touch anything. He's not allowed to touch the controls. If you have to do anything, you do it yourself. All right. So the prim and proper pilot is putting you in the policy with the mclernon learning next to you and telling you that if this thing needs to fly, you're flying it. Yeah. And he already knew that, you know, over the years I'd learn how to do it. You'd been in an aircraft so much that you can learn how to do it by watching them. And then if you get a chance to fly it or I say, can I fly it and they'll let you fly it? And that is really, you know. So I had you prior to this particular day, had you ever actually taken the controls? Yes. Oh, yeah. OK, you're right. Yeah. But you know that that really is knowing when to get out of it. And just by seeing the people run away or I knew then that something's coming. And they obviously had some form of indicating they'd been mortared before, but they weren't sure where it was coming from. And obviously, you don't want to be there with three thousand pounds of high explosive and all these weight you are shooting at us . Yeah. And there are 80, 81 millimeter mortars. So the big ones, you know, and that was another if you want to call it a little story and nothing really exciting or, you know, but, you know, sometimes, you know, you are lucky if we do stay there. We probably got blown up, you know, along with a pile of other things. If anything, hit that ammunition. Yeah. But she didn't, thank heavens. All right. And then the the total, if you want to call it the watching, a you know, to Harrier jump jets attack. A it's quite amazing because it's really quite close. And with the technology that they had, they could pinpoint where they these people were and they staffed and they bombed. And then for the rest of the day, there were no mortars. And that's really how life is. Yeah, that's a little less gritty and. Oh, wow. So the no sixth sense of play there. You saw the guys on the ground scatter and that gave you the heebie jeebies enough to say this time to be somewhere else. We need to go somewhere. And again, the same sort of thing is when you put in troops in particularly when the the battle area is moving fast or, you know, coming backwards and forwards, or you want to know exactly where you are. All right. Because one other little incident that happened was we overshot what they call the forward edge of the battle area. And when we landed, I looked to the left of the aircraft, which is what you often do. And then I could see all these soldiers dug in. And I realized that there there were only about 100 meters away from us. What's what's the problem with that? Or are these these are the baddies, OK? These are these are not these are not your soldiers. These are no, these are the other soldiers. These are the other soldiers we've overshot. And now we're only about 100 meters away from them. And the stickered troops that I've got in the back are carrying a 50 caliber machine gun. All right. And I shout to them where the soldiers are and they're Argentinean. And the guy with the 50 cal gets underneath the aircraft and he opens fire. And instead of the soldiers staying in this. Trenches, they all stand up and run away. And of course, then you know what's going to happen? He's going to shoot them. And in the meantime, you know the politics going on. What the hell's going on down? About the same pile. Yeah. And he's finally gotten over his nerves a little bit. And of course, they're firing away. And I'm thinking only shit. All they can do now, if the Argentineans stay there and open fire, they get us because there would be nothing we could do. And you don't know that you're being shot her in a helicopter. All it is, is if it's something you might know, you know, then you can look at the Pink Panther. But then when you get back there, there'll be holes in the aircraft and, you know, in the or in the rotor blades or something like that, that's when you know that you've been shot on. But the other thing is, you know, when you become afraid, which I'm now afraid because the guy is firing and all they need to do is fire back at if they get organized and shoot back, it's just going to be ugly. So they obviously panicked and start to run away. And then he got the better of them. But we're trying to get away. So the troops are jumping out. And as soon as they're out, we have to go now. Ghauri. And you can feel afraid. And, you know, I'm I don't want him in there. I was afraid. And I was laying on the floor of the aircraft and I'm saying, break to the right. And I'm saying break right or I because I know the land sloping and we can get down there and go faster. And I'm laying on the floor and I'm thinking, why am I laying on the floor? Because the fuel tanks are underneath me or I. And so now I try and stand up and we are going as fast as we can turning. And I'm trying to stand up and get behind what I think might protect me. And there's nothing in the helicopter. It's just space. And and so I'm thinking I'll get back down there. And, of course, I'm getting I'm getting down. And I don't know what to do. And I'm afraid I don't think there's anything wrong with being a friend in that circumstance. And then I've been afraid of a lot less things than that. You put a spider in my bedroom and but but again, you know, it's that sort of thing, you know, how many times have I been afraid? Lots. And, you know, it comes at the strangest moments. You know, like all of a sudden I'm on the big crewman in the back saying they're over there, shoot em. You know, not to show like that. And as soon as they start shooting, I want to lie down. And so, I mean and I still think about it today. You know, like you never know what you're going to do or when when you think you might do it, you know, and but it was just funny. And when I think of the the pilot or I he was the same, you know, actually when when that happened, he was quite good and he didn't do anything wrong. And he just knew that I had to stay low and go fast and turn to the right. And that's why he was doing, you know, so interesting, the the the stress and fear effecting people different. Same person, similar circumstance, but very different effects, which is one of those proof in the training is in preparation. So you can try and be as familiar as possible with not only what might happen, but what your reaction to it might be. Yeah. And it's like everything, you know, until you actually do it, you're not really going to know how you're going to react, you know. And it could be doing the type of job we do, you know, teaching people for the offshore. And I always do. And I tell people, you know, I can tell you what I think's going to happen or I but I don't know how you're going to react if this happens, you know. And so even though we have great knowledge of that, you know, what can go wrong and you know how it all should play out. You never really know how the individual is going to react. No, you don't. You don't. You really don't. I I'm a big believer in the the offshore being a good example of a place where they do those weekly drills, the muster drills, which is super repetitive and boring. And I and I get that people get complacent. But it's a simple, straightforward act so that even when a person is very, very afraid, even though taking that simple action, I just grab this bag and go to the muster area. Even that's a pro it's an effective thing to do. But there's also the other thing is that, you know, when you've done that sort of thing or, you know, you've got to the muster point or whatever. There comes a time where everybody or you might be faced with. I've got to think for myself now, what am I going to do? Am I going to jump off? Am I going to stay? You know, so. It's a fine line, you know, at some stage you might have to choose. I've got to do this, otherwise I'm not going to survive. But it might be opposite what you're being told to do. That's the other thing, you know. Yes, indeed. Yes, indeed. There's certainly precedent for that, too. We hear the stories from the some of the survivors of Piper Alpha who basically had to jump off a gigantic platform or otherwise burned to death. And we can see other evidence of that. And I hate to bring up touchy ones, but 9/11 is a good example of people jumping out of burning buildings because jumping is better than standing there and burning. Yeah. Yeah. But as you say, not knowing what you're because you don't really know. You really don't know how you're going to react, how it's going to play out, what's what's going to go through your mind and what your reactions are going to be until you're actually there. Yeah, and that's true. You know, it's one of those things, you know, you if you've ever been to a band road accident, you know, and you and you look and you think, well, who do I do with first? You know, what am I going to do? You know it, you know, and you see children and things like that and you think, don't look after the children or, you know, is this person bleeding to death in front of me? And it doesn't take long to bleed to death. You see, it's that type of thing. Mean talking? Yeah, I've had a few I've had a few serious medical emergencies, but never where I had to prioritize casualties in any way that it was anything less than obvious. Yeah. Like I never had to make a choice between the children who might be hurt and the adult who was obviously bleeding out and never had to make that call. Oh, I hope I never do it again and again in the sort of combat areas, you know, when you pick somebody up who's badly injured, you know, or badly mutilated to be the word. Right. The the medics and all the the guys that do that for a living then worth their weight in gold. You know, I'd rather have, you know, a team of medics around me if I've got my leg missing than, you know, I know the doctor probably knows how to tidy all up and maybe stick one back on Cooroy. If you know, if if you could just get through today. But but, you know, at the end of the day, the guys are doing it all the time, you know, and they don't really get enough praise of the medics and the people that are in the back of the aircraft for that sole reason of keeping people alive till you get them somewhere. I can imagine that an experienced combat medic would learn to do some tricks and say, OK, we have to do this right now or we're going to lose them. Some stuff that you wouldn't even see in a modern E.R., because there's it's a different mentality. And in an E.R., you've got a backup and support and machines and lots of gear, whereas in the back of a helicopter, there's you there's your you're a first aid bag. And then also injured person anywhere you go. And it's better when you, you know, particularly in the combat role. You know, in the first Gulf War, I would fly with a fully operational medic in the bank. Right. Because we knew that some of the injuries are going to come through the door or even though we can get them quickly, even though I know a lot about first aid and what to do and when to do it, or I, I might not be able to keep him alive like a a fully booted and spurred medic could, you know? Yeah. The their ability to do things to start suturing or start clamping things on the inside wouldn't want to have to do that now that they will. OK. Well, I think that will take us to the end of this session. I want to thank you so much again for being here, Peter. Your stories, as always, remarkable and interesting, and in this case, a little scary and a little tense. But it's fantastic to to talk to somebody who's been there and done the things and seen senior incredible things. So thanks again for joining us. My pleasure. Flattery will get you everywhere. OK, folks, thanks for tuning in. And we'll see you next time. You can find us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Amazon Music, Stitcher and almost anywhere you can find podcasts. If you're enjoying the podcast, please subscribe and help us move up the charts with a five star rating. We like comments and reviews, so we'd love to hear from you. If you have a story to tell or know of someone who does, please contact us at legacy survival stories. All one word at Gmail ICOM. You can also find us at legacy survival stories. Dot Buzz, Sprout dot com. And you're going down. You go down. So now the legacy survival stories.